Updates and downloads

[treasureman]

With the advent of the new Pheonix nozzle, will there be any information in the download secition posrted showing take down, re build, pressure settings etc???

[luis]

It is basically a Royal Aqua Master. The only extra part that has been added to the system is the replaceable volcano orifice (from the Titan).

If you want to down load the Titan repair manual for the parts list reference, it is available from this link:
http://www.frogkick.dk/manuals/aqualung/
or this one:
http://www.deepsouthdivers.org/aqualung.html


Since it is a Royal Aqua Master, everything that that applies to a RAM applies to a Phoenix RAM.

It is true that many of us are tuning our Royal to a finer degree than shown in the original manuals.
Not only are we using higher IP, but some of us are adjusting the spring tension in the second stage by backing the spring holder, etc.
The fine tuning is the same whether it is a RAM or a PRAM.

[Nemrod]

I wish a few people had asked to dive a Phoenix at Weekie Wachee. My buddy Jake dove mine but since he is not a vintage diver he has no frame of reference.
The little things add up.

The two/three immediate impediments to further increasing performance beyond or equal to something like an AL Legend is:

1) A supply of soft silicone cage valves

2) A DSV mouthiece with large cage valves and of course the closing valve to allow surface swimming and prevent uncontrolled freeflow on the surface and to act as a resistence vane

3) either very soft silicone duckbills or a mushroom valve conversion using a domed upper can with center mushroom valve like the Mentor.

James

[Greg Barlow]

I wish a few people had asked to dive a Phoenix at Weekie Wachee. My buddy Jake dove mine but since he is not a vintage diver he has no frame of reference.
The little things add up.

The two/three immediate impediments to further increasing performance beyond or equal to something like an AL Legend is:

1) A supply of soft silicone cage valves

2) A DSV mouthiece with large cage valves and of course the closing valve to allow surface swimming and prevent uncontrolled freeflow on the surface and to act as a resistence vane

3) either very soft silicone duckbills or a mushroom valve conversion using a domed upper can with center mushroom valve like the Mentor.

James

Aqualung really dropped the ball when they introduced the "new" Mistral on the market. Had they realeased the Mentor to the general public, then we would have had an excellent modern double hose regulator.

Greg

[ebj]

"but some of us are adjusting the spring tension in the second stage by backing the spring holder, etc."

Luis
Please explain how you are increasing the spring tension. The second stage leaking on my RAM is the limiting factor in raising the ip.

[luis]

I am not increasing the spring tension (actually compression), I am decreasing it. If you need higher second stage spring force, you should replace the spring with one of Bryan’s that he includes in his rebuild kits.

Then it is possible to adjust the spring force (to some degree) by backing the spring support. It is a course adjustment since you have to turn it 120 degrees on every adjustment in order to have a venturi nozzle pointing into the hose horn. Also if you back it too much you loose the locking feature provided by the base of the two horseshoe pivots.

The fine tuning of balancing the pneumatic force due to the intermediate pressure against the spring force is then accomplished by adjusting the IP. I often check how much intermediate pressure will take to get the second stage to free flow before I even install the horseshoe. I want the 2nd stage to be sensitive enough so I don’t have to run an IP higher that around 155 psi.

On average my double hose second stages will start free flowing with an IP of around 155 to 165 psi. The final IP adjustment tends to be around 140 to 150.

I try to adjust any of the octopuses that I may attach to my RAM or any of my Phoenix RAM so they will not start free flowing until 160 to 175. This helps from having an octopus free flow. I use some of the low profile Oceanic swivel octopus and with an IP of 140 to 150 they breathe very well.

With this procedure and a reproduction silicon diaphragm, I am consistently getting a regulator cracking effort of around 0.5 inWC. I measured breathing resistance at the end of a hose about the same length as our intake hose, but with no mouthpiece valves. I am not trying to simulate any particular condition; I am just taking consistent comparative readings among different regulators.


The adjustments that I am performing are not as described on the USD maintenance manuals, this is just the way I do it.

[luis]

I wish a few people had asked to dive a Phoenix at Weekie Wachee. My buddy Jake dove mine but since he is not a vintage diver he has no frame of reference.
The little things add up.

The two/three immediate impediments to further increasing performance beyond or equal to something like an AL Legend is:

1) A supply of soft silicone cage valves

2) A DSV mouthiece with large cage valves and of course the closing valve to allow surface swimming and prevent uncontrolled freeflow on the surface and to act as a resistence vane

3) either very soft silicone duckbills or a mushroom valve conversion using a domed upper can with center mushroom valve like the Mentor.

James

Hi James

I think I may have some relatively simple solutions for items 1 and 3. Maybe not perfect solutions, but big improvements. I will talk to you soon. They are ideas that I am developing, so I don’t want to post anything until I have more certainty about the results.

For Item 2, I have an easy solution. The poor mans DSV. Just carve a small mouthpiece plug out of a nice piece of wood like Teak or a small block of plastic (Nylon, Delrin, etc.) and attach a lanyard to it. It is not the most elegant solution, but it would work.

[standingup]

James

For Item 2, I have an easy solution. The poor mans DSV. Just carve a small mouthpiece plug out of a nice piece of wood like Teak or a small block of plastic (Nylon, Delrin, etc.) and attach a lanyard to it. It is not the most elegant solution, but it would work.[/quote]

wouldn't this still allow the air to flow thru the mouthpiece and out the duckbill and thus freeflow? By the way I'm really interested in a Luis and Bryan DSV

[Nemrod]

No, it does not because the duckbill opening is at the same postion as the main diaphram therefore generally it will not freeflow if the mouthpiece is closed off.

When resting on the surface and leaning back with the mouthpiece below your chin the main diaphram is lower than the mouthpiece and it freeflows. Stick your fingers over the mouthpiece COMPLETELY closing the mouthpiece off and it will stop.

James

[ebj]

Luis
Thanks for your explanation on adjusting the second stage spring. I am using one of Bryan's springs, but haven't been able to get ip above 140 without air leaking. I'll try your method next time time...probably just too much spring tension in my initial rebuild.

[standingup]

No, it does not because the duckbill opening is at the same postion as the main diaphram therefore generally it will not freeflow if the mouthpiece is closed off.

When resting on the surface and leaning back with the mouthpiece below your chin the main diaphram is lower than the mouthpiece and it freeflows. Stick your fingers over the mouthpiece COMPLETELY closing the mouthpiece off and it will stop.

James

Quite true but if you just want to "float the hose" and snorkel don't most DSV's work by sealing off the feed hose? Us cheapskates can really extend our swim and dive time by snorkeling until we find our spot. In the old days it could be done by shutting off the tank valve, but my arms don't bend as much anymore?

[capn_tucker]

James[/quote]

Aqualung really dropped the ball when they introduced the "new" Mistral on the market. Had they realeased the Mentor to the general public, then we would have had an excellent modern double hose regulator.

Greg[/quote]

Amen to that. But even if they did release it, at $3000 freaking bucks each, they'd still be out of reach...

[luis]

Luis
Thanks for your explanation on adjusting the second stage spring. I am using one of Bryan's springs, but haven't been able to get ip above 140 without air leaking. I'll try your method next time time...probably just too much spring tension in my initial rebuild.

As long as the spring force and the pressure force are close to being in balance, it is not very important what the actual intermediate pressure is adjusted to (within a reasonable range).

[Nemrod]

"Quite true but if you just want to "float the hose" and snorkel don't most DSV's work by sealing off the feed hose?"

No again, the DSV valves I have seen have a tube inside a tube that closes the mouthpiece to prevent any water from entering the rebreather system but if it just closed the intake hose that would still work for a double hose application.

As to surface snorkling, that is all good but I am using my Phoenix in a modern setting using a back plate and wing rig most of the time and I have been diving that way since about 1978 and with a wing it is by far more comfortable to me to swim on my back on the surface and of course with my mask propped on my forehead. Also, both the horsecollar and the wing type BCs both tend to float the resting diver in a backward lean most comfortably and of course both of these positions result in freeflow. Surface swimming face down or snorkel use while on the surface does fine without a DSV but then I cannot see the boats about to run me over--each to their own methods.

Use of a DSV would allow me to tune my Phoenix even further than it is now. My Phoenix now cracks just a little tighter than my Legend. The Legend of course has both a vane and a reesistence knob adjustment--the DSV valve would --sorta--provide this same funtion for the Phoenix allowing very low cracking efforts to be tuned in. As it is now I generally detune (backing the IP down) my Phoenix and my other RAMs when travelling in places I don't want to have to stop and work on the dang thing. With a DSV I would not have to do that.

None of this matters that much unless your using your double hose in conditions that modern divers would employ a AL Legend or Apeks or top of the line ScubaPro. Why not just use my Legend--well---those are for girls, that is why. .

As to second stage spring force vs IP I do a rough setting and then dive it in the pool, I then adjust it again and dive it again and so on until I have a setting that performs well and yet is still stable. By stable I mean that it does not freeflow when it should not, is not jumpy, performs the same way at all depths and the same every day. I have touched on this probably in this thread but the new blue HP seats are easier to set than the NOS seats. why does it take several pool dives to settle in, well, the springs are taking a set, the seats are taking a set and so on. Initial settings change quite a bit over these first tuning dives after a rebuild.

Nemrod

[JES]

".... As to second stage spring force vs IP I do a rough setting and then dive it in the pool, I then adjust it again and dive it again and so on until I have a setting that performs well and yet is still stable. By stable I mean that it does not freeflow when it should not, is not jumpy, performs the same way at all depths and the same every day. ....

Nemrod, Excellent information! OBTW, how deep is your pool?

For those who aren't as mechanically inclined, remember you can elect to have Bryan install and adjust your Phoenix RAM for you.