CAP2ND1961
Lung Diver
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 3:27 pm
First Name: Cletus
Location: Tilghman Island MD. (eastern shore)

Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:52 pm

Hello all.

I have a question about wing/plate placement for my Kraken.

I experienced a bit of wet breathing today while diving. It was just a slight drip like gurgle, that I was more of an annoyance than anything else.
I was in shallow water around 10 feet max doing a pier inspection. When I got out I noticed the wing material was blocking the bottom vent ports of the can, and when I lifted the hose assembly up vertical a bunch of water came out of the bottom vents.

I think maybe the wing was interfering with the exhaust flow causing a wet draw? Ive used this reg a dozen times or more, and this is the first time I have noticed this. All my tube connections are tight and the hose does not appear to have any holes in it. I am attaching some photos of how I rig it up. I have seen where some have the wing go totally infront of the cans. Which I would think would make the cans to far away from your shoulder blades?
I was diving my dry suit so I use the suit for buoyancy control.

Thanks for any tips or information.

Cheers~ Clete

This is how I rig it up.

However during entry or the dive the plate must have shifted cause a fold of material to cover the bottom vents, which I think cause a exhaust flow restriction?


Image

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Nemrod
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Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:23 pm

I doubt the wing blocking a few of the exhaust holes would have any issue since many of us dive with wings in similar position as yours with no problem. Not entirely sure from your description if the water is in the mouthpiece, exhaust or intake side?

You might check:

Hose clamps
Hole in a hose (soap it)
DSV not fully open ( or needs cleaning and lubrication)
Body not properly tight to can allowing O-ring to leak
Mouthpiece bite leaking at DSV
Curled wagon wheel mushroom valve

Nem

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ScubaLawyer
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First Name: Mark
Location: Laguna Beach, CA

Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:03 am

Nem has all good ideas on possible causes.
The only time i have ever experienced a wet draw on a DH was when the reg fell over on a dive boat and, unbeknownst to me, the inhalation horn cut into the hose making a small hard to see rip. Thought I was gonna die but I relied on my high tech alternate bail-out system and that saved my life. My high-tech system? Swim up toward the surface while exhaling. Works most every time. Mark.
"The diver who collects specimens of underwater life has fun and becomes a keen underwater observer. .. seek slow-moving or attached organisms such as corals, starfish, or shelled creatures." (Golden Guide to Scuba Diving, 1968) :D

CAP2ND1961
Lung Diver
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 3:27 pm
First Name: Cletus
Location: Tilghman Island MD. (eastern shore)

Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:09 am

I believe it is a supply side issue.

Thanks for the info, Ill check all those things. How often do I need to clean and lubricate the DSV? I think this may be the culprit.

Clete

Does anyone here modify their wing to fit under the can better like use some type of paracord to constrict it , or is it better just to tuck it all up under there like I have done?

CAP2ND1961
Lung Diver
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 3:27 pm
First Name: Cletus
Location: Tilghman Island MD. (eastern shore)

Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:12 am

ScubaLawyer wrote:Nem has all good ideas on possible causes.
The only time i have ever experienced a wet draw on a DH was when the reg fell over on a dive boat and, unbeknownst to me, the inhalation horn cut into the hose making a small hard to see rip. Thought I was gonna die but I relied on my high tech alternate bail-out system and that saved my life. My high-tech system? Swim up toward the surface while exhaling. Works most every time. Mark.
:shock:


:D

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ScubaLawyer
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First Name: Mark
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Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:18 am

CAP2ND1961 wrote:Does anyone here modify their wing to fit under the can better like use some type of paracord to constrict it , or is it better just to tuck it all up under there like I have done?
I've done it both ways (had an old OMS wing with bungies) and, aside from looking more streamlined when deflated, it's still fills the same space when inflated. I have never experienced any problems using any kind of wing with a VDH backplate and DH reg. Blocking a few exhalation holes shouldn't have any effect. Your setup looks spot-on. Good luck. Mark
"The diver who collects specimens of underwater life has fun and becomes a keen underwater observer. .. seek slow-moving or attached organisms such as corals, starfish, or shelled creatures." (Golden Guide to Scuba Diving, 1968) :D

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Nemrod
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Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:31 am

I think your wing is fine and it's postion. The sleeker VDH wings (plug for site owner) or Oxy wings are more suitably narrow up top. But your wing is fine.

As to DSV cleaning and lubrication, I suspect it has to do with several things, like sandy environments. Luis and Bryan can answer that as to what the need is to clean/service. One of mine was leaking, I found some grit in the O-rings, I had been diving the Destin Jetty, and it is sandy there. I set the reg down, in the sand while I was kitting up :( . Hey, it (my Kraken) has to live in the real world, cannot baby everything. I think a regular cleaning of the DSV might be a good thing. Those new screw clamps Bryan has are the dealio for quick removal and service of the DSV.

This is not likely with a Kraken, but it is possible, but especially with a metal can reg, to pinch or install the diaphragm such that it leaks. But with the Kraken, make sure that the diaphragm is seated and that the six screws are positioned correctly so that you do not accidentally run a screw into the diaphragm and hole it.

Nem

CAP2ND1961
Lung Diver
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 3:27 pm
First Name: Cletus
Location: Tilghman Island MD. (eastern shore)

Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:01 am

Good call on the grit. I dive in some crappy conditions and lots of sediment/silt/sand and the likes. Ill break down rig and make sure everything is clean and grit free. I saw a video Bryan put up about taking the DSV apart and re assembling, Ill just re watch that an follow along.

Im heading to the exhumas in Feb for a some live aboard action on the AquaCat and I plan on bringing my Kraken and my single hose. It will be nice to actually have some nice clear warm water for a change. So I need to make sure my Kraken is in A1 condtion. Water temp during my dive today was around 48, I called it after about 30 minutes. I dont have dry gloves yet, my fingers were getting numb.

A few stills from today. I got a sealife dc2000 and I am still working getting the settings right. Im used to more manual control on my nikon land cam. It does pretty good, but the autofocus can get easily fooled.

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CAP2ND1961
Lung Diver
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 3:27 pm
First Name: Cletus
Location: Tilghman Island MD. (eastern shore)

Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 6:20 pm

I think I found the culprit. The mouth piece I installed is loose and can be easily moved around in a circle. It has a preset snap tie that can no be tightened any further. See the pictures below, I would think this would be where the water is leaking in. I rotated the dsv and it is smooth no signs of grit. I either need a new mouth piece or a better fastener.

Image

I can easily rotate the mouth piece around. Im pretty positive that I should not be able to do that.
Image

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couv
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Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:54 pm

CAP2ND1961 wrote:I think I found the culprit. The mouth piece I installed is loose and can be easily moved around in a circle.
Yes, fix that first.

Next, check this: When you rotate the DSV you should feel a bit of resistance just before it reaches the full open or full closed position. If not, the o-ring (in the rectangular groove) around the port that serves the mouthpiece could be compromised.

(Thanks to Luis for sorting mine out recently.)
A sincere THANK YOU to all at VDH who make this wonderful resource available and to all the thoughtful contributors.

CAP2ND1961
Lung Diver
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 3:27 pm
First Name: Cletus
Location: Tilghman Island MD. (eastern shore)

Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:42 pm

couv wrote:
CAP2ND1961 wrote:I think I found the culprit. The mouth piece I installed is loose and can be easily moved around in a circle.
Yes, fix that first.

Next, check this: When you rotate the DSV you should feel a bit of resistance just before it reaches the full open or full closed position. If not, the o-ring (in the rectangular groove) around the port that serves the mouthpiece could be compromised.

(Thanks to Luis for sorting mine out recently.)

Thank you! I will be checking on that next.

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ScubaLawyer
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First Name: Mark
Location: Laguna Beach, CA

Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:01 pm

Ah! The dreaded loose zip-tie failure. :D
"The diver who collects specimens of underwater life has fun and becomes a keen underwater observer. .. seek slow-moving or attached organisms such as corals, starfish, or shelled creatures." (Golden Guide to Scuba Diving, 1968) :D

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Nemrod
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Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:17 pm

CAP2ND1961 wrote:I think I found the culprit. The mouth piece I installed is loose and can be easily moved around in a circle. It has a preset snap tie that can no be tightened any further. See the pictures below, I would think this would be where the water is leaking in. I rotated the dsv and it is smooth no signs of grit. I either need a new mouth piece or a better fastener.

Image

I can easily rotate the mouth piece around. Im pretty positive that I should not be able to do that.
Image

Yes, loose mouthpiece bite, that will do it.

Nem

CAP2ND1961
Lung Diver
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 3:27 pm
First Name: Cletus
Location: Tilghman Island MD. (eastern shore)

Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:11 pm

Different question here. Is it necessary to sanitize the hose loop regularly?
If so, what is recommended?


Thanks CAP

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ScubaLawyer
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Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2010 11:25 am
First Name: Mark
Location: Laguna Beach, CA

Re: Wing position with Kraken and Kraken back plate.

Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:35 pm

CAP2ND1961 wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:11 pm
Different question here. Is it necessary to sanitize the hose loop regularly?
If so, what is recommended?
Thanks CAP
I'm sure everyone does it differently, but whenever I'm done diving (whether for the day, weekend or week) I take the hoses off the horns, run warm water through them, then hang them up to dry (with the mushroom valves adjacent to the mouthpiece pointed downward so it will drain). I hang them up in a cool dry place because too high humidity and/or lack of air flow has the potential to cause growth of nasty stuff inside (said from personal experience based on neoprene hoses - not sure of the potential on the newer silicone hoses.) Doing that, you should not have any problems. My 2psi. Mark

For cleaning hoses with nasty stuff inside see the maintenance section for excellent advice. https://vintagedoublehose.com/care-maintenance/
"The diver who collects specimens of underwater life has fun and becomes a keen underwater observer. .. seek slow-moving or attached organisms such as corals, starfish, or shelled creatures." (Golden Guide to Scuba Diving, 1968) :D

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