swimjim
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:22 pm

I take my tanks directly to the Hydro facility. That really cut costs. Regrettably they usually come back flash rusted so I sometimes have to tumble them depending on the severity. Upgrading to a Cyclone is nice, but I would just do a rebuild and go from there. The DA is a really good reg just the way it is. If you have a buffer wheel polish up the horse shoe where it makes contact with the LP diaphragm. That will make a big difference.
As previously mentioned, positioning is everything thing with a double hose. Those cans really need to be tight to the back between the shoulder blades. If you can do that, you will enjoy the heck out of diving your DA! :D

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Chris
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:24 pm

Herman sells tools that are great. Exspesialy the one to assemble the first stage. When you get to that point.

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ScubaLawyer
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:09 pm

Great! Now I have it in my head that I want to rebuild a stock AquaMaster. Argh.....
"The diver who collects specimens of underwater life has fun and becomes a keen underwater observer. .. seek slow-moving or attached organisms such as corals, starfish, or shelled creatures." (Golden Guide to Scuba Diving, 1968) :D

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Nemrod
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 12:49 am

ScubaLawyer wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:09 pm
Great! Now I have it in my head that I want to rebuild a stock AquaMaster. Argh.....

Oh, and welcome to the club. You may find collecting vintage gear addictive and possibly expensive. But there are worse things.

James

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Chris
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:33 am

ScubaLawyer wrote:Great! Now I have it in my head that I want to rebuild a stock AquaMaster. Argh.....
Ya, me too. Even keep the duck bill, just for kicks. I need to start hitting the garage sales.

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ScubaLawyer
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 2:20 am

Nemrod wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 12:49 am
ScubaLawyer wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:09 pm
Great! Now I have it in my head that I want to rebuild a stock AquaMaster. Argh.....

Oh, and welcome to the club. You may find collecting vintage gear addictive and possibly expensive. But there are worse things.

James
Of the 20+ DH regs I have rebuilt, the only regulator I have rebuilt stock is my Voit VR-2. I used it at Sea Hunt Forever in Silver Springs and it breathed remarkably well for a non-venturi reg. Mark

Image
Image
"The diver who collects specimens of underwater life has fun and becomes a keen underwater observer. .. seek slow-moving or attached organisms such as corals, starfish, or shelled creatures." (Golden Guide to Scuba Diving, 1968) :D

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Chris
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 2:43 am

ScubaLawyer wrote:
Nemrod wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 12:49 am
ScubaLawyer wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:09 pm
Great! Now I have it in my head that I want to rebuild a stock AquaMaster. Argh.....

Oh, and welcome to the club. You may find collecting vintage gear addictive and possibly expensive. But there are worse things.

James
Of the 20+ DH regs I have rebuilt, the only regulator I have rebuilt stock is my Voit VR-2. I used it at Sea Hunt Forever in Silver Springs and it breathed remarkably well for a non-venturi reg. Mark

Image
Image
My voit 50 fathom is almost stock. Band clamp and silicone diaphram. Also a nice breather for what it is. Makes me feel like diving my wetsuit more often.

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Formerly tripplec. Decided to use my real name since you guys aren't a bunch of flaky internet trolls.

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Herman
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 9:16 am

Welcome to the board. I think I see a couple items that others have missed.

You will want to replace the main diaphragm HOWEVER at this time no one that I am aware of has reproduction 2 stage ones available (has the 2 tabs) this pretty much requires you to replace the second stage with an HPR. The old diaphragm will work but even new they are no where near as good as a silicone one. Then there is setup, An HPR is pretty easy, the original assembly can be a real pain to get right.

To keep things as low as possible but make a reasonable diving reg I would go this way:

Replace second stage with HPR and use new silicone diaphragm
Install a DA rebuild kit, most likely you can resurface the HP seat
Install a Duckbill eliminator, it's not much more expensive than a duckbill and is easier to get right, esp when installing hoses.
IF and this is a big if, the hoses are reasonably soft, replace the mouthpiece valves (replacing them is almost mandatory) You do not have to replace the cages. You can always upgrade the hoses and mouthpiece later.
Install a band clamp if it does not have one, the C clips are a pain and it makes opening up the reg for inspection and cleaning (which you should do often) much easier.

One note about the banjo, you MUST have a long yoke to use it. There are 2 (3 actually- a heavy version was used in a few of the later ones, you are very lucky if you got one of those) versions of the yoke used on regs but since you have a late model it most likely has the long one but it's worth noting before you buy a banjo and can't use it . Personally, I would just use the J valve as it was intended. Unless it's a Voit, they had some reserve issues and should NOT be used unmodified, it's very likely the J valve is working fine. Do some easy dives to get use to relaying on time (to have some idea of your remaining air pressure) and the J valve. One way to easily test the J valve is to use it with a modern reg and a SPG - NOT an air integrated computer, their response time is too slow. In the "dive" position, the SPG needle should bounce down quite a bit as you breath and work as you are used to in the reserve position.....and you can use it old school to learn how to use it with your modern reg. While you are at it, you can start learning old school no BC diving with your modern equipment. Just kit up as normal but get your weights correct, deflate the BC completely and dive relying on proper weighting and breath control to control your buoyancy during the dive. If you must you can revert to modern style if you need to. This is a great way to get use to old school diving while having the comfort of knowing you have your modern gear as a back up.

By all means, ASK QUESTIONS!! We have a great group of very experienced guys who have lots of experience restoring, upgrading and diving the old gear. We are always happy to help out.
Herman

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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 12:15 pm

Herman wrote:Welcome to the board. I think I see a couple items that others have missed.

You will want to replace the main diaphragm HOWEVER at this time no one that I am aware of has reproduction 2 stage ones available (has the 2 tabs) this pretty much requires you to replace the second stage with an HPR. The old diaphragm will work but even new they are no where near as good as a silicone one. Then there is setup, An HPR is pretty easy, the original assembly can be a real pain to get right.

To keep things as low as possible but make a reasonable diving reg I would go this way:

Replace second stage with HPR and use new silicone diaphragm
Install a DA rebuild kit, most likely you can resurface the HP seat
Install a Duckbill eliminator, it's not much more expensive than a duckbill and is easier to get right, esp when installing hoses.
IF and this is a big if, the hoses are reasonably soft, replace the mouthpiece valves (replacing them is almost mandatory) You do not have to replace the cages. You can always upgrade the hoses and mouthpiece later.
Install a band clamp if it does not have one, the C clips are a pain and it makes opening up the reg for inspection and cleaning (which you should do often) much easier.

One note about the banjo, you MUST have a long yoke to use it. There are 2 (3 actually- a heavy version was used in a few of the later ones, you are very lucky if you got one of those) versions of the yoke used on regs but since you have a late model it most likely has the long one but it's worth noting before you buy a banjo and can't use it . Personally, I would just use the J valve as it was intended. Unless it's a Voit, they had some reserve issues and should NOT be used unmodified, it's very likely the J valve is working fine. Do some easy dives to get use to relaying on time (to have some idea of your remaining air pressure) and the J valve. One way to easily test the J valve is to use it with a modern reg and a SPG - NOT an air integrated computer, their response time is too slow. In the "dive" position, the SPG needle should bounce down quite a bit as you breath and work as you are used to in the reserve position.....and you can use it old school to learn how to use it with your modern reg. While you are at it, you can start learning old school no BC diving with your modern equipment. Just kit up as normal but get your weights correct, deflate the BC completely and dive relying on proper weighting and breath control to control your buoyancy during the dive. If you must you can revert to modern style if you need to. This is a great way to get use to old school diving while having the comfort of knowing you have your modern gear as a back up.

By all means, ASK QUESTIONS!! We have a great group of very experienced guys who have lots of experience restoring, upgrading and diving the old gear. We are always happy to help out.
Herman, thank you for the great advice. I’m 99% sure I have the long yoke. Not sure if it is the heavy version you mentioned.
Image

While I don’t love the cost of the banjo, I’m inclined to go that route because I will likely update the tank valve to a modern DIN with conversion fitting (my modern 1st stage is DIN). What would be a reasonable price for a banjo?

I have yet to crack the can open (c clips), but the hoses seem to be in surprisingly good condition. I think they just need a thorough cleaning.



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ScubaLawyer
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 12:41 pm

502Diver wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 12:15 pm
While I don’t love the cost of the banjo, I’m inclined to go that route because I will likely update the tank valve to a modern DIN with conversion fitting (my modern 1st stage is DIN). What would be a reasonable price for a banjo?

I have yet to crack the can open (c clips), but the hoses seem to be in surprisingly good condition. I think they just need a thorough cleaning.

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Yes, you have a long yoke.

I've seen banjos going for anywhere from $35 to $75, with most being in the middle somewhere. The other day I was rooting around in an old workbench drawer belonging to my late father and found two banjos. One was highly pitted and unuseable. The other was still in the bag it was purchased in. :)

Your AM should clean up real well. It looks surprisingly similar to mine. :)

Image
"The diver who collects specimens of underwater life has fun and becomes a keen underwater observer. .. seek slow-moving or attached organisms such as corals, starfish, or shelled creatures." (Golden Guide to Scuba Diving, 1968) :D

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Herman
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:28 pm

Yep, that is a long yoke.
When removing the C clips is a bit of a pain. I use an end nipper with the face ground off flat.
IMG_1175web.jpg
IMG_1176web.jpg
IMG_1178web.jpg
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Herman

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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 2:08 pm

Herman, I’m having trouble seeing the pictures. Could you try posting them again? Removing the c clips is something I haven’t found much on yet.


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Herman
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 6:05 pm

the photos look fine to me, have you tried on a computer? I can email them to you if you need me to.
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:08 pm

Herman wrote:the photos look fine to me, have you tried on a computer? I can email them to you if you need me to.
They finally showed up. Might have been a network issue on my end. Thanks!


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Nemrod
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Re: New to Vintage Double Hose: Mass Confusion

Fri Nov 29, 2019 12:29 am

Mass confusion, it can only lead to something like this:

Image

There are a few missing as they are in pieces still. I need to start downsizing. Not just diving gear, too much stuff, too little time.

James

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