captain wrote: ↑
Sat Jan 12, 2019 12:14 pm
Here is a question for Luis, is the assignment of the plus to a tank documented by the hydro shop. I ask because I always get a copy of the test results data sheet. No where on the sheet do I see a spot for documenting that the cylinder was assigned a plus or not.
If you have the test data and know the ree of your tank you can determine if the tank qualifies for the plus.
That said would you stamping the plus on the tank be a violation of regulations even if the data says it has qualified for the plus.
Yes, they are supposed to document it. It is kind of the old EMS saying: “if you didn’t document it, you didn’t do it”. Notice the words "supposed to".
Most facilities don’t bother doing the + stamp so they don’t have a special column on the form to mark it, but I have seen it marked with a + next to the pass.
If the cylinder is not stamped with the REE number, they are supposed to attach a copy of the document that provided the REE number.
When my LDS (the one that closed in 2015) did in house hydro testing I provided a copy of my REE calculations and supporting data. They stapled it to the back of the hydro data sheets.
I met the local DOT inspector at the LDS a couple of times and she like the documentation I provided. I even asked it if she would like me to stamp my calculations with my engineering license seal, but she said the calculations was more than sufficient.
On a previous occasion that same LDS was fined a few thousand dollars just for taking short cuts and being sloppy on their record keeping. Some of the short cuts that they got hit for seemed ridiculous, but it was obvious that they got a bit lax and were missing some data, like incomplete serial numbers, etc.
If you stamp your own + on a cylinder, it is not likely that you will ever get caught, unless an LDS knows that the local hydro stations never does the + stamping or a similar situation.
It is very easy for anyone to verify if a + stamp is legitimate. The RIM number on the hydro stamp can be easily checked at the DOT website and the phone number of most facilities is listed. Someone would have to go through the trouble of calling the facility and the facility has to find the records. It will probably will not happen. But if it did, in theory, that cylinder could be condemned for having false markings. Again not likely.
What is really bad is some of the pictures I have actually seen on the internet (in ScubaBoard, etc.). I have seen “+” stamps that were actually done with a chisel. The indentations were very symmetrical (at 90 degrees) and looked OK. But because they were done with a chisel they were too deep. And the depth of the indentation is actually very solid reason to condemn a cylinder. An indentation that is too deep can be considered a gouge. A legitimate stamp has a flat surface that will not allow any indentation to go too deep. As opposed to a chisel that is design to cut as deep as possible.
In VSS someone once tried to argue that it was common practice and perfectly legitimate to use a chisel to mark the “+” stamp. He provided pictures of cylinders that actually (from the look of the pictures) had deep + stamp gauges which if anyone was paying attention they should have been condemned (just due to the depth of the “+ stamp”).
The CGA (Compress Gas Association) documents clearly states the maximum depth allowed for any gouge or pit, and the depth of an external gouge like a stamp is easily measured.
I have also seen pictures on the internet with VE stamps that looked questionable. Out of pure curiosity I looked up the RIM number on the DOT site and it opened a few more questions. I couldn’t really tell if the hydro facility was still in business. It probably was but I didn’t look into it further due to lack of interest.